I Need a Favorite Team

Depends if "colors" are really important.

I plumped for Yokohama BayStars - sometimes they suck, sometimes they can explode and do great things.

You mention about places you are going to see, but you have chosen places all over Japan - Fukuoka, Hiroshima, Osaka, Nagoya, Tokyo, and Sapporo? Kind of random really.

Why not find out which area you are going to predominantly stay in - if possible - or even plan your trip around the baseball dates. Whichever team you can theoretically see the most - that's your team?

In all honesty, my recommendation is to just start becoming familiar with all 12 teams now, and then let your destination in Japan actually decide who you become a fan of. I'm primarily a Fighters fan almost completely by chance - several years ago I was in Tokyo, decided I wanted to see a game, ended up sitting in the middle of the Fighters' cheering section at the Tokyo Dome. Poof, instant Fighters fan. And to be fair (some people will disagree with me on this, but) it's okay to pick two or three teams to be your favorite. The Dragons are really my CL team, and the BayStars are my "local" team. It's not cheating on the Fighters, because the other teams are in the Central League, see. But, you're actually kind of better off not picking a favorite and just going to a bunch of games and experiencing the fans and deciding based on that. Wouldn't it suck if you bought a jersey and whatever and then found out that in reality you really didn't like the stadium/fans/team/experience/etc?

That said, the Tigers have a log of foreign fans, so at least there's a bunch of stuff out there about the team in English, if you need that. I don't think I've actually ever even seen another foreign Fighters fan out in the cheering sections, to be honest, which makes it all the more fun because I have to read about everything in Japanese.

Anyway, uhh...

Giants: Yeah, exactly, they're like the Yankees.
Tigers: Well, then they're the Red Sox. YMMV.
Dragons: If you're going to a Dragons-Giants game at the Tokyo Dome you can sit in the bleachers and yell "YOMIURI TAOSE O!" after every player's cheer, which is great fun. Team has the best middle infield known to man. Also Doala is awesome.
Baystars: Great fans, great stadium (to me - no fences). Lots of young players with potential. Team boasts both the player who uses the most hair gel in Japan (Miura) and the player who has the most bizarre mound-ascending routine in Japan as well as throwing motion (Kizuka).
Swallows: Biggest wild card in the league next year as they've just drafted some big-name pitchers, but since they also don't like to spend any money there's a good chance they'll suck next year. However, Jingu is a historic stadium and Swallows fans are also pretty laid-back.
Carp: Just lost their two biggest-name players, and had a not-particularly-inspiring draft. I feel really bad for Carp fans. You can't go wrong rooting for them if you like the underdog, but in all honesty in that case you would be better off rooting for Rakuten next year.

I have trouble talking about the PL without being even more biased, so eh.

- You mention about places you are going to see, but you have chosen places all over Japan - Fukuoka, Hiroshima, Osaka, Nagoya, Tokyo, and Sapporo? Kind of random really.

Not really random. Only half the teams mentioned in those games are the home teams. For example, I'm not going anywhere near Sapporo.

I'll fly to Tokyo and after being in Japan 8 days or so, I'll take the ferry to South Korea from Fukuoka. I have a starting location and an ending location and the middle will be somewhere in between. I just haven't decided upon any itinerary in between. Most likely I'd choose to attend a game in Tokyo on my first couple of days or a game in Fukuoka on my last day before taking the ferry.

- In all honesty, my recommendation is to just start becoming familiar with all 12 teams now, and then let your destination in Japan actually decide who you become a fan of.

Very good advice. If I study the players, I'll probably develop an affinity for a few of them. My ideal favorite player is a young pitcher with a lot of potential.

As far as destination being a deciding factor, not such a good idea because that makes the Giants attractive. The Swallows are probably the anti-Giants much like the White Sox and Mets are anti-Cubs and anti-Yankees. But I don't like the profile of the Swallows not being willing to spend.

- Wouldn't it suck if you bought a jersey and whatever and then found out that in reality you really didn't like the stadium/fans/team/experience/etc?

Not if it's a cool looking jersey with a player's name and number on the back. I'm thinking the combination of "cool jersey" and being a team that I can see this May will probably be the strongest indication. And as for a team that I can see this May, it should be a team I can easily see on future trips to Japan. (Not the Giants!)

- That said, the Tigers have a log of foreign fans, so at least there's a bunch of stuff out there about the team in English, if you need that. I don't think I've actually ever even seen another foreign Fighters fan out in the cheering sections, to be honest, which makes it all the more fun because I have to read about everything in Japanese.

In 2 weeks I begin taking Japanese 101 at the local community college. I hope to get thrown into the Japanese culture 100% when at a game.

Fighters fan... Funny, but it amuses me to split the team name and nickname a little differently and call them the "Ham Fighters." If they had jerseys that said "Ham Fighters" on them, I'd be an instant fan.

- Giants: Yeah, exactly, they're like the Yankees.

D@mn Yankees!

- Tigers: Well, then they're the Red Sox. YMMV.

But they have cool uniforms.

- Dragons: If you're going to a Dragons-Giants game at the Tokyo Dome you can sit in the bleachers and yell "YOMIURI TAOSE O!" after every player's cheer, which is great fun. Team has the best middle infield known to man. Also Doala is awesome.

I like the team name "Dragons," but I don't like their Dodger-like uniforms.

- BayStars: Great fans, great stadium (to me - no fences). Lots of young players with potential. Team boasts both the player who uses the most hair gel in Japan (Miura) and the player who has the most bizarre mound-ascending routine in Japan as well as throwing motion (Kizuka).

I like a team with personality. But I don't like the nickname "BayStars."

- Swallows: Biggest wild card in the league next year as they've just drafted some big-name pitchers, but since they also don't like to spend any money there's a good chance they'll suck next year. However, Jingu is a historic stadium and Swallows fans are also pretty laid-back.

I like teams strong on pitching.

- Carp: Just lost their two biggest-name players, and had a not-particularly-inspiring draft. I feel really bad for Carp fans. You can't go wrong rooting for them if you like the underdog, but in all honesty in that case you would be better off rooting for Rakuten next year.

Cool uniforms.

Whatever uniform I would buy (and become my favorite team), I would wear it in the U.S., so it would need to look nice.

I can't find a Swallows uniform available anywhere on the Internet. The Carp have a nice uniform available which includes any player's name and number. The Tigers have a nice uniform that's easily available. If the Swallows' uniforms were available to purchase on the Internet, I'd have my favorite team probably picked.

Ok, I admit that I'm looking at the superficial more than the substance of the teams. But I have to start somewhere.

The Swallows are out of contention as my favorite team. Been reading this board and seeing how they let good players go (Ramirez and Gresienger). I need to cheer for a team that at least tries to win.

The Hanshin Tigers' Koshien Stadium near Kobe is a historic baseball landmark, not just for Japan, but for the history of baseball itself. It is akin to Wrigley Field or Fenway Park. It was built in 1924, and has been the home to the Tigers since 1936.

The Tigers also have the most devoted, emotional, fanatical, and colorful fans in Japan. The team's yellow and black color scheme makes for excellent souvenirs and merchandise. Don't forget to visit a Hanshin Department Store, and pick up plenty of Tigers merchandise!

And, since the Kansai area (Osaka, Kobe, Kyoto) is far more interesting from a tourist perspective than the Kanto (Tokyo) area, I'd recommend making that your home base for both baseball and tourism.

Sigh.

You're kind of contradicting yourself a lot. Saying things like "I hate the Yankees," then saying the Tigers (who have decidedly Yankee-like uniforms) have cool uniforms. The Dragons also don't have the ridiculous Dodgers-like uniforms anymore either and haven't in quite some time.

Yes, everyone says "Ham Fighters" and thinks they're brilliant and funny. I gave up on trying to correct them a looooong time ago. It's a lost cause.

For the record, you can go to a Giants game and be completely anti-Giants. Heck, I once went to the Dome and cheered for the Carp, just to be anti-Giants. In Japan, there's always a cheering section for the away team. I haven't been at a Fighters home game since 2003, but have always sat among a full outfield of Fighters fans anyway. And if you're thinking "In Tokyo, must see the Giants," then that's not really right either, as it's possible to be staying in Tokyo and go see any of 5 teams - Lions, Marines, Swallows, BayStars, or Giants. The Swallows are as close to the center of town as the Giants are, honestly.

As for finding uniforms, again, I honestly think you're better off coming here and buying one, especially because then you can also make sure it fits. But whatever you want, since yes, if you're going on superficial things, then "cool uniform" is as good a place to start as any, I suppose. Though if that's all you're going on, I don't see why there's any point in any of us telling you about the teams themselves.

For the record, if you want to follow a young pitcher with lots of potential, then you likely want to be a Pacific League fan anyway, and go for Darvish (NIP), Wakui (SEI), Naruse (LOT), Tanaka (RAK), Hirano (ORX) or Mahara/Wada/Sugiuchi/whoever (SFT).

-You're kind of contradicting yourself a lot. Saying things like "I hate the Yankees," then saying the Tigers (who have decidedly Yankee-like uniforms) have cool uniforms.

The only thing I like about the Yankees are their uniforms.

- Yes, everyone says "Ham Fighters" and thinks they're brilliant and funny. I gave up on trying to correct them a looooong time ago. It's a lost cause.

I thought I was the first brilliant one. I guess I won't qualify to be a writer for the commentary on "Iron Chef."

- For the record, you can go to a Giants game and be completely anti-Giants. Heck, I once went to the Dome and cheered for the Carp, just to be anti-Giants. In Japan, there's always a cheering section for the away team.

That's good to know. I was at a couple of games this past summer at Yankee Stadium to cheer for my Tigers. I kept quiet because I knew if I opened my mouth, I would get beat up.

- And if you're thinking "In Tokyo, must see the Giants," then that's not really right either, as it's possible to be staying in Tokyo and go see any of 5 teams - Lions, Marines, Swallows, BayStars, or Giants. The Swallows are as close to the center of town as the Giants are, honestly

You're right. But in Tokyo, I also want to attend the big sumo tournament one day, so baseball is my second priority there.

- [...] if you're going on superficial things, then "cool uniform" is as good a place to start as any, I suppose. Though if that's all you're going on, I don't see why there's any point in any of us telling you about the teams themselves.

Knowing about the teams is very important. I've eliminated the Swallows and Carp because their prospects for competing aren't good. My factors are:

1. Decent team that's trying to win
2. Good pitching
3. Central League team - no DH
4. Will be able to see them in May
5. Cool uniforms

- For the record, if you want to follow a young pitcher with lots of potential, then you likely want to be a Pacific League fan anyway, and go for Darvish (NIP), Wakui (SEI), Naruse (LOT), Tanaka (RAK), Hirano (ORX) or Mahara/Wada/Sugiuchi/whoever (SFT).

I'm being drawn to the Pacific League here. And a Ham Fighter is on that list.

I do not want to choose a team based on Americans on the team.

The Hanshin Tigers' Koshien Stadium near Kobe is a historic baseball landmark, not just for Japan, but for the history of baseball itself. It is akin to Wrigley Field or Fenway Park. It was built in 1924, and has been the home to the Tigers since 1936.

Another reason pushing me towards the Tigers.

- The Tigers also have the most devoted, emotional, fanatical, and colorful fans in Japan. The team's yellow and black color scheme makes for excellent souvenirs and merchandise.

I guess I can't become a passive Tigers' fan.

- And, since the Kansai area (Osaka, Kobe, Kyoto) is far more interesting from a tourist perspective than the Kanto (Tokyo) area, I'd recommend making that your home base for both baseball and tourism.

Good point. I'm flying to Tokyo and flying home from Seoul. Not counting arrival and departure days, I'll have 16 full days. South Korea is much smaller than Japan, so if I split my trip 9 days in Japan and 7 in S. Korea, I could easily attend a Swallows/Tigers game on 5/16 and be down to Fukuoka on 5/18 for the Ham Fighters/Hawks game. I could then spend 2 days in Tokyo seeing the sights and take in some sumo before heading south.

For me the Tigers are just like the Giants. I actually dislike them more, but this year I think the Giants took the cake. So many people love the Tigers it almost makes me sick. The fans are loud and annoying, which I guess is good if you like them, but if you root against them it makes it that much sweeter if your team beats them. Granted, they don't spend the money that the Giants do, but they do spend a lot.

- So many people love the Tigers it almost makes me sick.

Yeah, seeing loyalty in others has that effect on some people. But hey, the reason I follow the Tigers is because they're my local team - I can't help it if they're popular. Maybe the reason the fans are loud is that there are just so many of us.

In your seven days in Korea are going to see any Korean Baseball Organization (KBO) games?

- In your seven days in Korea are going to see any Korean Baseball Organization (KBO) games?

I hadn't considered it. I would like to. Unfortunately, I'm not aware of a great website on the KBO in English, especially not as good as this one.

I can get you a schedule of games.

The Seoul Travel Guide website is helpful.

I have been to Chamsil (Jamsil) Stadium. The subway system is color-coded. The Green Line will drop you within feet of the Chamsil/Sports Complex.

Tickets can be purchased on the day of game at the stadium (even playoff tickets).

Let me know your schedule in Korea. I can check on other stadiums in Seoul and Korea for game times and directions.

- I can get you a schedule of games.

You know, maybe I must see a game in S. Korea. I have a 13 year old nephew who is 1/2 Korean and also a very good baseball player. He'd probably love for me to bring back some Korean baseball stuff for him.

I see that Wikipedia has a very good summary of the KBO with a list of the teams and where they're located. I'll be in S. Korea the third week of May (probably the 19th-26th), starting in Busan and finishing in Seoul. With 2 teams in Seoul, there's probably a home game most days there. I'd love to know the schedule during this week and any Korean Baseball websites in English.

Thanks.

I kind of had the same conundrum as you. When I started following Pro Yakyu, it was purely because of Daisuke Matsuzaka and Hideki Okajima coming to the Red Sox, so I called myself a Lions/Fighters fan. Then, when I watched Matsuzaka against Kazumi Saitoh in the 2006 playoffs on YouTube, all of a sudden I became a Hawks fan.

Also added to it was the fact that I could watch the Hawks play on my computer if I got up early. My screen name my say NipponHam11 (which is Darvish's number), but I'm a Hawks fan until the bitter end. So maybe you'll be like me and stumble into your team.

- [...] I could watch the Hawks play on my computer if I got up early.

This is probably obvious to find if I surf the Internet, but are you able to watch all/most Hawks games on the computer? What website? If I can regularly tune in and watch a team's games, that will probably clinch choosing a favorite team. The easiest team to follow is an easy team to root for.

I've been reading more by going through the player's stats. I'm leaning towards a Pacific League team with all those fine young pitchers.

This thread pops up every once in a while and it never ceases to irk me. Why does one need advice online in picking a team to follow? If you're a true fan of baseball you don't need a legitimate reason to follow a team. I loathe the Giants, but I have many a friend who are fans of Yomiuri because it was the only team televised back in the day or because their parents backed them. I also dislike Hanshin, but living in Kansai, there are many die hard Hanshin fans who have stood by the team in good times and bad. I respect that.

It's quite simple actually. Pick your team and live with it, whether Hiroshima or Kyoujin, SoftBank, or Rakuten. Fair-weather fans come and go. Real fans stay loyal in good times and bad. No one's going to think less of you regardless of your choice. I hate on a lot of team's management, but never the fans. It's a game after all.

If you're looking for Korean league info check East Windup Chronicle. One of the guys who writes it lives in Korea.

I went to several games when I lived in Japan. Lots of fun. Different experience, but fun.

- This thread pops up every once in a while and it never ceases to irk me. Why does one need advice online in picking a team to follow?

Because teams have histories and personalities associated with them. Being very new at following Japanese baseball, I decided to seek out an understanding from others what the teams represent. Fortunately you're the only person I've seemed to irk and have received some very kind responses.

Actually, dude, we pretty much tried to tell you about the teams and their histories and situations, except you replied with "Oh, I just want to follow a team with cool uniforms that I can buy off the web."

I totally agree with kurohige. Either go choose a team based on your own admittedly-shallow reasons like buying a jersey online, or go choose a team based on the location you'll be in, or whatever team you start watching over the net. Let the team choose you, not the other way around. You really don't need us for that. Go do some research, and if you want to know more things that you can't find out in a web search, then ask questions.

- Actually, dude, we pretty much tried to tell you about the teams and their histories and situations, except you replied with "Oh, I just want to follow a team with cool uniforms that I can buy off the web."

First, my name isn't "dude." Second, your response was very rude. And third, you're selectively taking a small part of what I've written in this thread out of context.

I know you are looking for a CL team, but how about the Chiba Lotte Marines? We can always use loyal fans. The Marines also sometimes have a Ska-Punk band play outside the stadium, so that's another plus. They won the championship in 2005 and are still contenders. The Marines also have some great pitchers like Naruse and Watanabe.

Dear Stephen,

You should definitely pick the Chiba Lotte Marines. They have the best fans in the world. You should check out the Marines fans on YouTube. They wave a sea full of flags and they chant all day. Like what SKAcarino just mentioned, they won the championship in 2005 and they had the 3rd best winning % in NPB last year. I think they will win it all this year. Lastly, the Chiba Marine Stadium is located near Tokyo Disneyland, so you can visit Donald Duck, Mickey Mouse, and Cinderella after the game.

- You should check out the Marines fans on YouTube. They wave a sea full of flags and they chant all day.

Great information. In choosing a game or two to attend, the crowd and ballpark experience is definitely important.

But does he like your uniform?

- But does he like your uniform?

What's she wearing?

I think Stephen will really like the Chiba Lotte Marines' uniform. Their alternate cap looks great with the zig-zag patterns on their peak. I once saw them wear black pants. Baseball pants are not usually black, so I thought it was cool.

I don't think it really matters if the Chiba Lotte Marines are not a Central League team because Stephen is a lifelong Detroit Tigers fan and they are a DH team.

In my opinion, the Marines have the best pitching staff in the Pacific League with Naruse, Watanabe, and H. Kobayashi.

The Marines also have extremely simple cheers and songs to learn, even if you don't know Japanese, so I guess that's a plus in some cases. Me, I enjoyed actually learning new kanji and vocabulary words back when I was first doing ouenka with the Fighters, but I'm weird, so YMMV.

On the other hand, many other teams also have bands play outside the stadium regularly (during Kouhaku Uta Gassen I saw Toshihide Baba singing and was like "WOW! I saw that guy at Yokohama BayStars Fan Fest!") and all of the teams have large groups of fans waving flags and chanting all day, so that isn't really specific to Chiba or anywhere else.

<rant>
You know there's really nothing worse in Japan than foreigners that go there and become Japan snobs due to a desperate need to try to fit into a culture that has very unique attributes and a pronounced sense of beauty, but also a very strong sense of "inside" and "outside."

Whatever form of insecurity exists in certain gai-koku-jin can sometimes lead them to take a Japanese-ier than thou tone when talking to other foreigners, and take every turn to remind everyone how they speak Japanese, can read kanji, know more about the nuance of the culture than you do, etc., etc.

I'm not sure what brand of foreigners is more difficult to deal with in Nippon - the self righteous kanji jocks or the backpacker types that never learn the language. At least the latter group isn't that pretentious.

Fortunately, there's a lot of cool folks out in Japan that can just remain who they are and be themselves - and still learn Japanese and appreciate the culture without feeling the need to rub it in other people's noses at every turn.
<</rant>>

As far as the team goes, I'd go with Hiroshima (they have a cool, small town-ish kind of vibe at their games), or just go 360 and root for the Giants. They're the evil empire of Japan, but they have a lot of excellent players and quite cool uniforms, if that's a consideration. Giants get on TV a lot more as well and are the easiest to follow. Plus their games are packed. Chunichi are actually quite fun to watch as well and have a loaded interesting roster.

Wow, and he said I was rude?

Seriously, do you know the Marines' chants? I used to really like the Marines a lot a few years ago, but then I went to the stadium and tried to cheer for them, and realized that no matter how much I liked some of the players, I wasn't all that into singing things like "WE LOVE LOVE LOVE, LOVE MARINES" or "Benny would go!" or the 90% of them that seemed like they were just "LALALALALALALA" while jumping up and down. I still like the team, I still like going to their games (and would root for them to win over any non-Fighters team), I just don't usually feel like sitting in the cheering section is all, and that takes away a bit from the fan experience.

Marines fans are great people in general, but the songs aren't all that particularly interesting to me. (You can read lyrics to a lot of them on this site, among others.) It makes sense that people would have easier songs to sing rather than the complicated stuff some other teams have; if nothing else, you don't have to look silly holding lyric sheets for a few games because it takes so bloody long to learn all the cheers! Since this thread is supposedly about the benefits and disadvantages of being a fan of any of these teams, I think "easy cheers" is a pretty valid pro or con.

So where exactly does that give you the right to go off on some "Oh my god, I'm so sick of these foreigners who like studying Japanese" rant? You remind me of some of the other people at my company who basically think there's something wrong with people who would rather be able to speak when ordering food here instead of pointing at pictures and grunting. It makes me sad when I run into people like that.

Yet, somehow, despite that I have lost all of my personality trying so desperately to fit into this country, I still can't understand these "cool" people who recommend following the Yomiuri Giants, so obviously something has gone wrong with the assimilation process. Please help?

- <rant/>

I agree. Although I haven't been in the situation of your first situation, I have traveled quite a bit and experienced the American traveler who makes no effort to learn even a few words of the local language and blindly expects everyone will speak English. If someone is going to make the plans to take a trip abroad, at least make a little effort to learn at minimum the basic greetings, "yes," "no," "please," "thank you," etc.

Now my rant... Why do the Asian baseball players in the Major Leagues always seem to have an interpreter by their sides? And I don't mean when they first join the team. I mean in their 2nd, 3rd, 4th, etc. season in the U.S. I've never once seen an interpreter by the side of a Hispanic baseball player.

After the 2007 All-Star Game in which Ichiro was named the MVP, they interviewed him. He had a freaking interpreter relay the questions back to him in Japanese then translate his Japanese answers back into English. And how long has he been playing in the U.S.? I have read on the Internet that he speaks perfect English. But why the interpreter? Is it some sort of image thing? Byung Hyung Kim continued to have an interpreter with him several years after playing in the U.S.

Ok, now a question on the flip-side. How many of the American players in Japan make an effort to learn Japanese? I hope the answer is "most," but I suspect it's "few."

Hi, Stephen

Shigetoshi Hasegawa didn't need an interpreter. Ichiro has pretty good English, but he doesn't have perfect English. Most Japanese players in the Major Leagues have interpreters because they do not want to be misquoted or misunderstood by the media. Even though they could speak fairly good English they still have a Japanese accent. I think there is some sort of image thing. The Japanese are generally shy people (hazukashii) and they prefer not to do things that may potentially embarrass themselves in front of the public.

Information on how you can watch the Hawks and Eagles via the Internet is available by going to the Media Guide forum in this website.

- How many of the American players in Japan make an effort to learn Japanese? I hope the answer is "most," but I suspect it's "few."

I'd say most of them make an effort, but few master the language. But as a fan, frankly I'd be worried if a gaijin player got paid big bucks by my team to play baseball over here only to ended up devoting himself to learning the language and immersing himself in the culture!

Hi,

I have posted a similar threads a couple of years ago. I live in Montreal, and when the Expos left I didn't want to follow the MLB anymore; so not knowing anything about baseball in Japan I asked people to help me pick a team.

I am not a fan of the DH, and I've always prefered the underdogs, so I started to follow the Hiroshima Carp. But I couldn't connect with the team.

The big difference for me was to be able to actually watch my team play over the Internet, and that is what made me root for the Rakuten Eagles. DH, Ugly hat, not a good team. But a team that I can watch.

- I live in Montreal, and when the Expos left I didn't want to follow the MLB anymore [...]

You didn't naturally want to start following the Nationals? I know someone from Montreal and he's very anti-Nationals!

- The big difference for me was to be able to actually watch my team play over the Internet, and that is what made me root for the Rakuten Eagles. DH, Ugly hat, not a good team. But a team that I can watch.

I think that's what I'm learning and am arriving at. The ease of following a team from my living room is probably the most important factor. I'm not interested in following a team via updated standings the next day.

You've mentioned being able to watch the Eagles via the Internet. Someone else mentioned being able to watch the Hawks via the Internet. Is this viewing of games from the teams' web pages or from some other web page?

Nobody criticized anyone for studying Japanese. It was for the frequency with which you're reminding other non-Japanese speakers (rather unnecessarily) that you do. It's kind of a given that you should study Nihongo - you live in Japan.

Could be wrong, but my guess is that if your co-workers get annoyed at times, it's not because you're studying the language, but perhaps because they feel you're trying a bit too hard or using your language skills as a way to look down on them for not being as gung-ho about it as you are.

Baseball wise, what's wrong with rooting for the Giants if you like them? For better or worse, they are the kind of "Face" of NPB and the most accessible team. Maybe their front office is a pain, but watching Uehara pitch is awesome, Shinnosuke Abe is fantastic catcher, and Toyoda is an effective setup man. They have a fun team to watch, even if you might be a bit ashamed to admit you cheer for them.

So much for this discussion, thanks for tolerating this silly discussion Mr. Administrator.