Doom and Gloom [Updated]
Japan: Get rid of the Gaijin quota like the soccer league in Europe. Bring in high profile players. Integrate the league into Major League baseball. Name it "Japan League".
US: Get rid of the teams in Milwaukee, Tampa, Minnesota, Pittsburgh, etc where they can't compete with the payrolls in the bigger city. Only keep the cities who can compete for A-Rod-like salary. Instead bring in Tokyo, Osaka, Yokohama, Nagoya, Fukuoka, Hiroshima, (and maybe even Taipei, Santo Domingo, Mexico City, San Juan, and Seoul can compete in an "International League"). Watanabe can be an owner for Tokyo team.
National League, American League, Japan League and International League will compete for a real World Series.
I know....this might be far fetched but its a nice try isn't it?!
Now, Mexico City, et.al. replacing Milwaukee, etc. sounds like a good idea to me. When they expanded a couple of years ago, teams south of the border (not the Canadian border) should have been considered (more seriously if they were).
Of course, the next step to my "master plan" was to have the I/E-Pacific League participate in the World Series. That way only one series would need a lot of logistical planning for players adjusting to time zones.
Inter-league play, where the Pacific teams tour a few North (and Central/South) American cities, and vice-versa, could follow that. As could expanding to Austrailia, China, and western Russia.
To get rid of the gaijin quota, there has to be some sort of incentive. True internationalization can be that incentive.
[Format edited by: westbaystars on May 27, 2002 9:14 PM JST]
This whole discussion is really interesting. Westbay-san brings up some cultural factors that I've personally never even contemplated before and that deserve some attention.
But hoping that Shigeo Nagashima, who, if anything else, is not just the face of conformity and the predominance of old school thinking on the Japanese pro scene, but has been rewarded handsomely for it, could help lead the way for innovative approaches to the maladies that pro yakyu is suffering from, I believe, is perhaps naive. Certainly, if you could get Mr. Giants on the side of those changes it would help enormously. But this is a guy who had a chance to play for the L.A. Dodgers and turned it down "for the good of Japanese baseball." Therefore, I'm not optimistic that Nagashima is interested in rocking the boat.
Human nature being what it is, it could be that the calcified leadership, headed by Watanabe, won't move to really do anything until there is some huge crisis in the game, whether it is the Kintetsu Buffaloes ceasing to exist because they are losing $12-15 million a year and Orix and Seibu ending up on the brink of bankruptcy due to declining fan turnout. On the other hand, Seibu owner Tsutsumi has said that he thinks it's good for both the players and Japanese baseball for them to want to go to the major leagues in saying that he would let Kazuo Matsui go to play in Seattle or elsewhere, depending on who wins the bidding for his services if Matsui does indeed choose to go the posting route.
With the coming of the World Cup in baseball in a couple of years, I don't think that a transnational baseball league is really workable due to the limitations of current transportation technology and questions over how you draft players, not to even mention sovereignty questions. However, we could have a system like thay have in English soccer. You have a national champion in your country's baseball league, then the winning team moves on to an international club tournament. This would no doubt necessitate the shortening of the major league season to 145-150 games, but it would enhance the prestige of baseball everywhere. In keeping with that, I think the ending of quotas on non-Japanese players in the Central and Pacific Leagues would be a great one.
Then every two years, you have World Cup matches, basically of national all star teams, held in the spring. Therefore, by the combination of the World Cup and then an international club tournament you would have both an impetus for maintaining individual local teams as well as satisfy the quest for each nation's baseball fans to show off their best native sons, too.
[Format edited by: westbaystars on May 27, 2002 9:15 PM JST]
But my main point is about fans. Fans are often brought up by MLB proponents when discussing what is great about baseball in the States. The flipside is often over looked: in a web-journal, Hanshin's Hansell has this advice for Ichiro and Shinjo on the difference between NPB and MLB: "The fans show up late, boo, and leave early."
Recently, the Chicago Tribune held an internet poll to go with Rick Morrisey's column. The subject? Morrisey complained that too many of the fans at Wrigley Field were not there to watch baseball, and would not trade Wrigley Field if it meant a World Series, much to the consternation of real Cubs fans. The poll was: what would you rather have, the World Series or Wrigley Field? The resuls? Over 6,000 responses, split virtually right down the middle. At least count, the World Series led by less than 100 votes.
Anyone who has been to a Cubs or Cards game in the last three years can attest to the mass exodus towards the exits following Mark or Sammy's last at-bat, regardless of the game situation.
Bill Veeck has this to say about fans in his book "Veeck - As in Wreck":
"You do, of course, have a small, loyal cadre of perhaps 83 technicians who will come out, regardless of the standings, to watch the geometric pattern of the game unfold in all its beautiful precision and balance. To them, the game's the thing. You will generally find them sitting in the bleachers....If you depend solely on people who know and love the game, you will be out of business by Mother's Day."
Fans are universal, and there's a lot to be said for familiarity breeding contempt. Japanese fans coming to the U.S. become enamored of the U.S. style of cheering, while American fans coming to Japan are impressed with the non-stop fervor of the ouendan. It's the same with the players. Japanese players find it easier to concentrate in the U.S., while American players find that the constant cheering, drums, and trumpets help them get pumped up for the game.
I sat in the Giants ouendan during Game 2 of last year's Japan Series. It was hot, smelly, and noisy, and it was an experience I'll never forget and am happy to have. That said, I'd probably never do it again, and I prefer the American style of cheering, if only because I like to root for my team all the time, and not just when they're up to bat. However, that's just my preference, and no reason to disparage the enthusiasm or knowledge of Japanese fans.
The casual fans coming out for the party will always, always, always outnumber the baseball fans coming out for the game by large, large numbers. That's the same in the U.S. as it is in Japan.
[Format edited by: westbaystars on May 27, 2002 9:19 PM JST]
Actually, I am strongly against getting rid of the teams in Minnesota and Pittsburgh. They have to much tradition (Kirby Puckett, Harmon Killebrew, Honus Wagner, Roberto Clemente, etc). I'm just so pessimistic about MLB's rising player salary without salary cap. At this rate, Yankees will win everything. By the way, I'm a St. Louis Cardinals fan from the late 60's.
The best example where the two hadn't seen eye to eye has got to be with the Olympics. Nagashima-kantoku is a huge Olympics fan, whereas Watanabe would have nothing to do with his player participating. Yet, after the Sydney Olympics were over, Watanabe mellowed a bit. Somebody correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought I read that Watanabe was considering backing they 2004 Games, complete with players. (Of course, I read one of those infamous "sports rags," so even if my memory doesn't fail me, it could have been false to begin with.) Nonetheless, assuming it to be true, was the reason because Japan came back metalless? Or due to pressure caused by Nagashima-kantoku constantly promoting the Games?
Furthermore, there are a number of players that Nabetsu wanted thrown away - like Kiyohara last year. Yet, Nagashima-kantoku had the last word - keeping the players he wanted despite critisism from Watanabe and his coaches. (I'm not judging the goodness/baddness of his desires, just that he usually gets his way.)
My example of getting Nagashima to catch onto a possible agenda was with inter-league play. It's already a popular idea with many fans, but not something that's grabbing headlines. However, if Nagashima-kantoku were to start mumbling about what a great idea inter-league play is, then there's a high possibility that even Ichiro can be dethrowned from the front page of the "daily rags." That's the kind of power that Nagashima-kantoku has over the press.
And once the press gets a hold of a Nagashima-kantoku idea (or better yet, phrase), it becomes a household idea (or phrase). It'll be unstoppable, taking on a life of its own. And since nobody can understand a great deal of what Nagashima-kantoku says (similar to the current U.S. President - "Is our children learning?" - I'll take "Make drama" over Bushisms any day) the press is free to cover the mumblings however they want. This is where people like Nuehnert-san come in. Knowledgable about the pros of inter-league play, and by taking a few Nagashima phrases that embody those pros, the whole country could soon be buzzing with anticipation for it. What could Nabetsu do about that other than hop on the band wagon? (Does the power of the press scare you, yet?)
Of course, inter-league play will take getting the other 5 Central League owners to agree. To them, market demographics of people who would be excited about seeing Ce-Pa matchups would be a must. Of course, they'd have to get published in one of Nikkei's publications for them to notice it. But, hey, a respectable journalist like Nuehnert-san should have connections there, too, right?
So, you see? Getting Nagashima-kantoku caught on an idea is the best marketing tool one can find. Not wanting to rock the boat is one thing, but how conventional is he? I still don't see him as a "yes man" to Watanabe's whim.
[Format edited by: westbaystars on May 27, 2002 9:22 PM JST]
Look how international soccer is. Why can't baseball be this international.
I'm just afraid that if Japanese baseball let go of the gaijin rule, Americans are just going to wipe out pro yakyu. USA is still after all a mighty mighty nation.
Oendan or no oendan? I choose oendan. kattobase- Kokubo!
You hit the nail on the head with your point about "current transportation technology." That's why I think that the logistics for a "real" World Series and/or even play offs would be the biggest obsticle. But I don't think that the current transporation technology couldn't handle an Eastern Pacific Rim League. That's a major reason why I put expanding to Austrailia, Russia, and China off for a bit.
More than transporation logistics, I think that economics is the biggest barrier to overcome. All of that travel costs. While it may be cheaper for a Japanese team to fly to Korea or Taiwan than within the country, will the teams from those countries be able to afford the trips to Japan?
Also, I was under the impression that Japan was taking this new World Cup Baseball less seriously than the Olympics. That is to say, one report I read had an all-ameteur sqad participating.
Personally, I'd rather see a "real" team play than an all-star team. And the Olympics and World Cup, "to show off their best native sons" promotes nationalism too much for me. I really don't like that. I find it more enjoyable to see a good, heathy mix of players whos' one common trait is that they all play for the same team. Nationality, skin tone, and any other way humans group themselves should have no relevance on the field. The team is just that, a team.
OK. So perhaps I'm a minority of one who doesn't get into nationalistic hype. But this is my dream. You're all welcome to submit your own.
[Format edited by: westbaystars on May 27, 2002 9:23 PM JST]
But, on the flip side, it's a scary thought. Look at how crazy and schizophrenic the American owners are, and they share common backgrounds and culture! Imagine bringing Watanabe and Tsutsumi in as well!
[Format edited by: westbaystars on May 27, 2002 9:24 PM JST]
As for MLB and NPB, I feel that if they were to follow the NFL "road", things would get better. Salary cap and revenue sharing would equal the field somewhat. That would give more of those less fortunate teams a chance to win. No team should be able to afford an A-Rod.
NPB should have interleague play. That would be nice. Also, no ties. This is a GAME.
Last, but not least, keep the Oendan going.
Here is my wild idea. Keep the quota as it is. Add a team, organized only with gaijin players (with or without MLB experience), for each Central and Pacific.
[Format edited by: westbaystars on May 27, 2002 9:27 PM JST]
Now back to bball. I'm reading a book "Furutashiki" (ISBN 4-87233-581-3), a long interview of the best Japanese catcher Atsuya Furuta. Here is a quote (page 108):
As a head of professional baseball players association, I talk to officers of various baseball teams regarding labor issues. One officer said without hesitation, "It's not quota issue. We don't need gainin at all. Playing only with Japanese would live up a ball game." Another officer said, "Don't need quota. We can make an interesting team with all gaijin players." Each team has their own opinion.
[Format edited by: westbaystars on May 27, 2002 9:25 PM JST]
The day Nabetune past away is the day Japanese baseball resurrect.
This is a site about Pro Yakyu (Japanese Baseball), not about who the next player to go over to MLB is. It's a community of Pro Yakyu fans who have come together to share their knowledge and opinions with the world. It's a place to follow teams and individuals playing baseball in Japan (and Asia), and to learn about Japanese (and Asian) culture through baseball.
It is my sincere hope that once you learn a bit about what we're about here that you will join the community of contributors.
Michael Westbay
(aka westbaystars)
Founder
This work is licensed under a Creative Commons License.
Some rights reserved.
Well, to put it mildly, I disagree.jballman was the first to submit this Kuehnert-san article from the Japan times, then aladdinsane-san posted the link to the PYML as well. I even mentioned some doom and gloom predictions by Sakai-san in Nikkan Sports as a follow up to this thread.
Nonetheless, reading Kuehnert-san's article made me think, does somebody have to twist his arm to make him watch Japanese baseball? Does he subscribe to a daily "sports rag" only because they pay him to? Is he writing this whine because bashing Japanese baseball with a Major League bat is popular right now? And what bothers me the most is that Kuehnert-san, with the influence that he has, doesn't use it to try to fix the wrongs, but just gripes and complains about the differences in the game between the two sides of the Pacific.
Now, yes, I do believe that there are problems that need to be taken care of in Pro Yakyu. And you can find a number of my gripes in these pages here. But you will also generally see suggestions accompanying those complaints. I don't feel it's worth wasting ones breath (or bytes, or dead trees) to complain about something without giving some sort of constructive advice.
As an example, I first started complaining about not having baseball on Mondays a few years ago. Whether it was my idea of "Monday Night Pa" that was the seed that grew into fruition this season or not, I don't know. But I didn't just complain about it, I made a suggestion. Now if some fan who happens to like to write his thoughts on a weblog can help to make that happen, then wouldn't a distinguished member of the press, who has access to people I've only seen on TV, have the ability to plant a crop of seeds that may grow?
[Please read the whole article for the full context.]
Yes, Nabetsu and the OB clubs are a major problem with Japanese baseball. But what would you (any of you) suggest be done about them?
I tend to satirize how Watanabe has more power than the Commissioner himself in hopes that someday a commissioner will come along and do to him what the MLB Commissioner's Office had done to Stienbrenner on a number of occasions - get him to stop medling with baseball affairs. I don't have the authority to make him stop. But Kuehnert-san has access to people who could help move the mountain - namely Nagashima-kantoku.
I, know. You all are probably thinking that I'm out of my mind. But Nagashima-kantoku has more popularity than God, and if Nagashima-kantoku wants something, so does the general public. All the power of the current U.S. President, and just as moldable. Get Nagashima-kantoku excited about interleague play with the drop of a few lines with him next time you see him, and see if it isn't something to be considered the next time you open your "daily rag."
Of course, you'll have to campaign with other managers, players, and especially those "old-far cronies," the OB clubs. If you really want change, then you need to give the cronies something to see when they do pull their heads out of the sand. Otherwise, with nothing better to look at, back in the sand they'll go.
Next, Kuehnert-san complains about how Japanese stadiums pale in comparison to their Major League counterparts. I agree, I'd really like to see real grass. I can't think of a more beautiful sight then when they put the grass back in at Candlestick Park back in the mid '70s. (I even got to go on a tour of the dug out and onto the field while they were still planting it during a pre-season trip to the 'Stick back then. Getting a personally signed photo of McCovey was the highlight of that trip for me. I wonder what ever happened to that picture - and my baseball cards.)
Anyway, does anybody know of any technologies to help drain 50cm of rainfall in an evening from a natural grass surface within a short enough period that the field will be playable should the next day simply be overcast? I know it's not a very good excuse, but artificial turf simply drains better. Perhaps someday we'll have stadiums like Safeco Field with a retractable roof so that the grass can grow (I heard it was theoretically possible at Fukuoka Dome). There was talk last year about building a new domed stadium in Yokohama. Somebody in the press could help push a Safeco-like design onto the public, who would practically demand it of the city.
Oh, are my suggestions starting to sound "unprofessional" for a journalist - who is supposed to just report on the news in a neutral way? I've never seen a journalist be neutral on any subject. I'm not, and I make that perfectly clear. If I've got an agenda that I would like to make known to the world, then I write about it. If I can think of counter arguments to my proposal, I'll often point out the down sides as well. And above all, I'm open to criticism - constructive criticism that is. If you don't like something I've said, feel free to tell me so. That's what the "Reply" button below is for. All I ask is that you state your position and back up why you think that way.
Nonetheless, I'm really going off on tangents this evening. I really didn't mean to write an essay about the way the press should work.
Next, Kuehnert-san compared the oendan driven Japanese fans to the "knowledgable" MLB fans. Hmm. I suppose that having Bobblehead Day (bottom of page) is a real clincher to get knowledgable fans out to the park. But seriously, head on out to the right field stands at Chiba Marine Stadium one evening. Especially an evening that a player (for either team) is approaching a milestone. These fans are not only knowledgable about it, but they often root in what appears to be against their own team for an opposing player to reach that milestone. Many a player who has done so has thanked the Chiba fans as well as their own for their gracious support. Can any fans in the Big Leagues compare to that class?
As for putting up with truncated broadcasts, I don't. The networks (NTV, TBS, Fuji, TV Asahi, Tokyo TV) have all let me down, so I got cable. (OK, so I got cable for the high speed Internet access, but ...) I generally watch Sky A or JSky Sports 1&2 which show the entire games. NTV teams up with NNN24 for the opening and closing of Yokohama games at Tokyo Dome (oh, I mean for all Giants' home games), and those few times when TVK's extended coverage isn't enough, their games are broadcast live on the Internet. Since getting cable TV, I very rarely stop at one of the network channels any more. It's their own fault for driving me away.
The problem here, though, like Kuehnert-san suggests, is that audiences put up with having the games only last a particular slice. But what Kuehnert-san doesn't do is take it a step farther and ask why that is? Might it be because the Japanese society has a certain desire for order? And schedules help to maintain that order?
The typical Japanese salaryman comes home from work, has a beer (I prefer Pepsi, myself) and dinner, watches the news, takes a bath, then goes to bed sometime between 12:30 and 2:00am (maybe after another beer). If the news is delayed 30 minutes due to a ball game going long (which is the typical case), that's within reasonable limits for the typical salaryman. If the news is delayed an hour or two (Lotte and Kintetsu squared off for 5 hours and 27 minutes a couple of days ago), then a lot of people are going to be thrown way off their schedules.
What's the solution to this problem in the U.S.? Well, they either cancel the next show or start the show already in progress. That doesn't sit well with a lot of viewers. It's easier to come into a ball game after the first couple of innings than a movie, yet it's the movie in the States that gets its beginning chopped off. Baseball lovers may appreciate it, but their families aren't necessarily as pleased.
Furthermore, can you say market blackout? Local games are generally blacked out to try to get more people to go out to the stadium to watch (unless it's a sell out). So, might this truncation of games be a less severe "partial" blackout approach? I much prefer to watch part of a game than to have it totally blacked out.
Do I like having to wait until the next day for the results? No. But I'm sure that the network programming managers have figured out that this way makes for the least amount of scheduling trouble.
Now, what can Kuehnert-san and the rest of the press do to try to get the network programming managers to change their minds? Why, make more people want to watch baseball on their channels! Yet, all Kuehnert-san is doing is turning people off of the local game and essentially telling his readers that they'd be better off watching Ichiro on NHK. I fail to understand how he thinks that society is going to change their habits and demand to see the full game after reading his article.
There are a number of things that Japanese baseball needs to do to better compete against other sports, other leagues, and other TV programming. My personal favorite suggestion that I'd like to see happen is the formation of an international league, a "true" Pacific League, where Taiwan, Korea, and Japan's Pacific League (to start with) compete with one another. Unlike suggestions to be part of the Major Leagues, the time zone problem is less than that going from the west to east coasts in North America. The major positive aspect is that each team gets to face a larger number of opponents, so it isn't, as Kuehnert-san put it, "so predictable, [...], and so boring." The down side would be that there is bound to be some very dominating teams (not necessarily only from Japan), and some teams that can't make the cut. I don't want to see "nationalism" rear it's ugly head with these competitions either. I think that a good way to combat it would be to do away with foreign player caps in the new league. Without Nabetsu having any say in matters, such a new league could break out of the old mold and give the Central League some real competition for viewers.
But, alas. I am but one voice without so much as a press pass. How will the "powers that be" ever know my ideas? How with the general public, who don't read my ramblings, ever be introduced to them? (I've got about 60+ regular readers, judging by my unique hit counts - and some of those are probably search engines.)
Kuehnert-san, should you stumble across this jumble of words, please don't take any of what I said personally. I'm sure you're writing like you've been trained to, to not directly interfere with the news you're reporting. Kind of like the Prime Directive, observe but don't touch. It's just that anything you write does touch upon the Pro Yakyu scene in some way, and it seemed so very negative to me. I'm hoping that you can see what you've written from a different perspective, and perhaps change over time. (Please, don't become over winded like me, though.)
Again, all constructive criticism welcome, anonymously or with a name attached. Just hit "Reply" below, and tell the world (or 60+ people).
[It was pointed out that I misspelled Kuehnert-san's name a number of times. That was not intentional, and, if you come by, I apoligize for the miss.]
[Format edited by: westbaystars on May 27, 2002 9:07 PM JST]